What is Heat Transfer? (And what happened to Academics?)

In this follow-up to the previous video on “What is Heat”, we have a physics lesson on the MODES of heat transfer and why all modes obey the same basic principles, such as heat flowing from hot to cold only. We also discuss the strange situation academia finds itself in today, with its believing in and active support of total pseudoscience.

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100 Responses to What is Heat Transfer? (And what happened to Academics?)

  1. Philip Mulholland says:

    Joe,
    Humanity has been set an existential test and we are failing catastrophically.

  2. Well…you and me and the others here aren’t…! Maybe we’ll inherit the world…

  3. boomie789 says:

  4. CD Marshall says:

    A great conversation I was not part of but still I thought was very good…

    Right or Wrong: Thermal radiation’s spectrum is continuous for earthly normal objects like a lite light bulb or a conductor, it is because once you plug every electron in the solid into a giant quantum mechanics equation, I personally call it a “giant fermi pool” while obeying the Pauli exclusion principle, I will end up with many energy levels for trillions of electrons, those levels are going to be quite continuous.

    Wrong. Thermal radiation is all about photons. It is obtained, when the modes of electro-magnetic cavity (e.g. vacuum inside a box) are occupied according to Bosonic statistics. The box can be imagined infinite, and one get’s continuum of photon states, and the number of photons in each state is given by the Bose-Einstein distribution. In other words, the electrons and nuclei of the ‘metal’ of the black box plays only a very minor role here. There is some particular light-matter interaction between the matter and the photons in the box. The exact form of this interaction does not matter to the end result. It is just sufficient that there is some interaction. Now, if the electrons and nuclei of the metal have a different temperature, mediated through light-matter interaction, heat will flow to the photon modes of the cavity until the light and the matter are in thermal equlibrium. This is related to the equipartition theorem, which needs to be applied to quantum energy levels of photons in order to avoid the ultraviolet catastrophe.

    Right or Wrong: Gas under atm pressure doesn’t emit continuous spectrum, because their atom’s electrons are so far apart, they are not interacting, each atom’s electrons are in their own isolated “fermi pool”. Different atoms can have electrons of the same energy state.

    Wrong. As discussed in part 1. the continuous spectrum is all about the photons being in thermal equilibrium. Thermal emission on atoms occurs when the temperature is sufficient large so that an electron can be thermally excited. This excited state of an atom does then couple only to very special modes of the cavity, namely to those which preserve energy and momentum. Therefore, one obtains sharp peak of photon energies when observing emission.

    Right or Wrong: A block of insulator will have a discontinuous thermal radiation spectrum at some temperature as its “internal conditions” (like crystal lattice or boundary condition) just won’t allow some energy state to exist.

    Wrong again, I’m afraid. It is true that semiconductors and insulators have forbidden single-particle levels, for example so that there is a gap between their photoemission and inverse-photoemission spectra. But the idea is correct, since there actually exists structures which have a photonic-band gap. Similarly to the electrons, given certain geometry of the cavity, photons too can have band gaps. Due to geometry (for example a periodic lattice of metal beads in a transparent substrate) there are forbidden energy-levels for photons. Keywords: opals (yes, the common gems have a band gap in such that particular wave lengths of light cannot propagate in them), photonic crystals.

  5. Kev-In-ZA says:

    Big thumbs-up…!

  6. boomie789 says:

    This nutjob probably has a degree.

  7. CD Marshall says:

    Yet just like this idiot I stopped arguing with on YT the total TSI at the equatorial zenith is around 940 watts per square meter per second because of albedo and subtracted from the TOA solar flux.

    Maybe this guy would debate you?

  8. boomie789 says:

    @CD Marshall
    I think I did ask this guy already.
    Thermodynamicist1215 lol.

    He diverted, he doesn’t have the balls.

  9. Barry says:

    Do I not understand this he is saying that the 1370 would be right at earths distance from the sun but not for earth. I’m confused

  10. boomie789 says:

    Yea That is a kooky one there.

    He’s the really confused one.

  11. CD Marshall says:

    NASA has known for over twenty years that solar storms deplete Ozone and failed to mention that bit of important information? Too funny.

    https://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/features/ProtonOzone

  12. CD Marshall says:

    “Their findings, published in the August 1, 2001, issue of Geophysical Research Letters, show that less than one percent of total atmospheric ozone in the Northern Hemisphere can be quickly reduced by one of these events. “It is an indication of the power of the sun to actually affect the atmosphere in a sudden, cataclysmic way,” Jackman says. While the results do not show a significant impact on human health, especially considering that most of the ozone loss documented in this study occurs over the northern polar region…”

    The poles depleted of ozone by the Sun. It would be interesting to do a research of solar storms to ozone depletion through the years and see how they correlate.

  13. CD Marshall says:

    Interesting climate science claims NO, nitric oxide, is not a greenhouse gas but evidence says it is similar to CO2.

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5562409/

    “NO molecules are often produced in an excited state from which they can emit IR radiation. Even after de-excitation, collisions with the heated background gas can re-excite NO to an active state.”

    CO2 is not IR active until excited either.

    Yet right here…
    http://www.soest.hawaii.edu/mguidry/Unnamed_Site_2/Chapter%202/Chapter2C3.html#:~:text=Neither%20nitric%20oxide%20nor%20nitrogen,these%20sources%20difficult%20to%20measure.

    “Neither nitric oxide nor nitrogen dioxide are greenhouse gases, although they are important in the process of creation of tropospheric ozone which is a greenhouse gas.”

  14. CD Marshall says:

    Interesting…

  15. CD Marshall says:

    So if Trump overturns this the Left will threaten the lives of the electorate college as the next step that’s my guess.

  16. CD Marshall says:

    I need a very educated rebuttal for this bs…
    //www.youtube.com/watch?v=SeYfl45X1wo

  17. That’s not showing the radiative Greenhouse effect…just scattering of IR in a 100% CO2 column. Did the back-scattered IR make the match burn brighter??

    You see this sophistry of just fn making shit up and performing “experiments” that have nothing to do with anything. It’s just a con using terms and demonstrations that no-one has any familiarity with…hence succeeds.

  18. There’s nothing wrong with a hot source radiatively heating a cool gas. What doesn’t happen in that vid is the heated but still cooler gas making the match, the source, hotter still. GHE people don’t know wth they’re even supposed to be talking about.

  19. CD Marshall says:

    Yeah they claimed the IR camera showed the heat was “trapped” by the CO2 and that’s why it wasn’t showing up on the camera. I have to admit this is a new one on me and I thought I had seen them all by now.

  20. IR light was scattered…that’s all…the gas column scattered photons to other directions hence making the flame appear dimmer. Heat trapping is a nonsensical term in any case.

  21. CD Marshall says:

    I agree but these are hard to argue to a dim/mid wit. The thing id the flames showed cold not hot…the exact opposite of the claim but you can’t argue that to an idiot.

  22. CD Marshall says:

    I found this comment in the video…
    “The IR absorbed by the CO2 is immediately re-radiated randomly in all directions (not retained). So those rays that were travelling from the candle to the camera are in effect scattered when CO2 molecules interpose between the candle and the camera.”

  23. CD Marshall says:

    Can a Solar Vacuum Tube really reach 370F? What’s the trick? Part of it is pressure but it has to be focusing the density of the solar flux somehow or something I’m not aware of?

  24. Leon says:

    Joseph,

    What will it take to get a real debate going with Roy Spencer et al? With all the ominous crap building up with more lock downs and Trudeau admitting to a “reset”, (something that will get you yanked from YT btw), they’re going to pull a climate lock down next. Have you seen the world economic forum’s video on 2030 sustainability? It’s spooky as f. First clip says “You will own nothing and be happy” with a grinning idiot for the camera. We need some c4 to get their attention. What would be their incentive to debate you? Money? What about a go-fund me with a charitable donation to the winner’s choice? We’re just running in circles here and we need to do something news worthy. I’m willing to do the leg work to facilitate this.

  25. Solar vacuum tube? But sure solar energy can do that with variations of emissivity and just a small amount of focusing of the light.

  26. Leon, perhaps there is no point trying to go through Spencer and the Warmists et al. They’re gatekeepers and they’ve always been the priblem

  27. Joseph E Postma says:

    Darn that comment got eaten by the WP app.

    There is no point going through the warmists and gatekeepers. As you saw, I asked Spencer to a debate and he ran scared and blocked me. Why go through them, why ask for their permission, why ask for them to allow themselves to be defeated? They never would…they’re not going to agree to a debate or showing where they know that they’re going to fail. No one would do that, let alone them.

    Any leg work you do is huge and everything helps. Share the videos on Twitter and tag people like Musk, Trump, university department & professors, other public entities, etc. It is expected to be ignored for a while…until we cannot be. Show these institutions righteous indignation and demand an explanation for why they support flat Earth theory. I’ll have more videos coming soon on that. The way this will develop is

    1 ignore/ridicule
    2 deny/fight
    3 accepted as self-evident

    We WILL WIN because we are at 3. We have 3 on OUR side…our position IS self-evident…we own it and it is our territory. And so we recognize that we will have to take others through 1 & 2. There is NOTHING more self-evident than a flat line, and they’ve provided it for us! But this will all take time because once people realize what has happened, it will be such an impact demanding tremendous reformation of the scientific establishment…because it’s a FN flat line Earth developed into physics!!! This has the potential to have the largest impact on modern science that has EVER occurred. And so we are damned well going to have to go through those three stages of truth. We all here…we’re already at 3, and we can rest-assured in our position there, at 3. We have the perfectly self-evident position, and knowing that, we must watch as others and the progress of the information for everyone else goes through 1 and 2 until it meets us.

    We WILL WIN…because we have 3. We own 3. We are the essence of 3. All we have to do is to not go away. All we have to do is to bother people and watch as they keep trying to ignore us, and, keep trying to fight us. But our position at 3 is infinitely strong, infinitely powerful, because a flat line is SELF fn EVIDENT. All we have to do is stay alive…lol.

    People like Spencer are at 1, and sometimes 2.

    I have a video I wanted to do this week sometime…and then I’ll do a video about us being at position 3, and how to use that position. In the end we won’t have to argue about the details of heat flow and the 1st Law, etc etc etc. No one will care about that. It will simply be self-evident that a flat line as the Earth is pseudoscience, and that will be the only argument ever needed and the only one anyone ever remembers. The general public isn’t going to have the mind for the details of heat flow and the 1st Law..etc., but, they will absolutely be able to laugh at the idea of a flat line representing the entire Earth! The general public WILL be able to grasp that perfectly and sufficiently.

    So yes…any leg work you can do is huge. Anything.

    Maybe we need a group name that subliminally queues off of 3 – Self Evident Climate Alarm Debunkers…lol? Anyone? Something that suggests that our position is self-evident.

  28. Darn that comment got eaten by the WP app.

    There is no point going through the warmists and gatekeepers. As you saw, I asked Spencer to a debate and he ran scared and blocked me. Why go through them, why ask for their permission, why ask for them to allow themselves to be defeated? They never would…they’re not going to agree to a debate or showing where they know that they’re going to fail. No one would do that, let alone them.

    Any leg work you do is huge and everything helps. Share the videos on Twitter and tag people like Musk, Trump, university department & professors, other public entities, etc. It is expected to be ignored for a while…until we cannot be. Show these institutions righteous indignation and demand an explanation for why they support flat Earth theory. I’ll have more videos coming soon on that. The way this will develop is

    1 ignore/ridicule
    2 deny/fight
    3 accepted as self-evident

    We WILL WIN because we are at 3. We have 3 on OUR side…our position IS self-evident…we own it and it is our territory. And so we recognize that we will have to take others through 1 & 2. There is NOTHING more self-evident than a flat line, and they’ve provided it for us! But this will all take time because once people realize what has happened, it will be such an impact demanding tremendous reformation of the scientific establishment…because it’s a FN flat line Earth developed into physics!!! This has the potential to have the largest impact on modern science that has EVER occurred. And so we are damned well going to have to go through those three stages of truth. We all here…we’re already at 3, and we can rest-assured in our position there, at 3. We have the perfectly self-evident position, and knowing that, we must watch as others and the progress of the information for everyone else goes through 1 and 2 until it meets us.

    We WILL WIN…because we have 3. We own 3. We are the essence of 3. All we have to do is to not go away. All we have to do is to bother people and watch as they keep trying to ignore us, and, keep trying to fight us. But our position at 3 is infinitely strong, infinitely powerful, because a flat line is SELF fn EVIDENT. All we have to do is stay alive…lol.

    People like Spencer are at 1, and sometimes 2.

    I have a video I wanted to do this week sometime…and then I’ll do a video about us being at position 3, and how to use that position. In the end we won’t have to argue about the details of heat flow and the 1st Law, etc etc etc. No one will care about that. It will simply be self-evident that a flat line as the Earth is pseudoscience, and that will be the only argument ever needed and the only one anyone ever remembers. The general public isn’t going to have the mind for the details of heat flow and the 1st Law..etc., but, they will absolutely be able to laugh at the idea of a flat line representing the entire Earth! The general public WILL be able to grasp that perfectly and sufficiently.

    So yes…any leg work you can do is huge. Anything.

    Maybe we need a group name that subliminally queues off of 3 – Self Evident Climate Alarm Debunkers…lol? Anyone? Something that suggests that our position is self-evident.

  29. Leon says:

    I know you say to leave it but that’s not in my DNA. I come from a long lineage of Mennonite pastors lol. Everyone has their price, be it notoriety or $$. Because they’re the gatekeepers, all the more reason to kick it down. To us, it’s clear a flat line isn’t representative of reality but to normies, they have no clue. But you are correct about normies falling asleep over discussions of heat transfer. These discussions get pretty complex. Need to think of a way to make it appealing. One of those ways is to give them a vested interest, what’s in it for them? Negotiations are always predicated on that. Asking someone for help or commitment needs to appeal to their sense of some kind of pay off. I want to find out what that would be.
    “They never would…they’re not going to agree to a debate or showing where they know that they’re going to fail. No one would do that, let alone them.”

  30. CD Marshall says:

    Leon I’m from a line of Collins one of them led a rebellion is Ireland. Some

    “Some are born great, some achieve greatness, and some have greatness thrust upon ’em.” -Shakespeare.

  31. CD Marshall says:

    Wow that got hashed to pieces somehow WP is acing funny these days or it’s just me.

  32. Leon says:

    CD,

    My great great grandfather negotiated the pilgrimage from Russia after the Mennonites were being persecuted and slaughtered, and led them to settle in Steinbach Manitoba. We have something in common.

  33. CD Marshall says:

    My brother’s line is a bit more glorious than mine lol. Not the same fathers obviously, but his line goes all the way back to Israel (line of KIsh) and to this day they are all ambidextrous (at least the males) by brother is, his father was and his grandfather and so on…his roots are in Hungary and then traced back the Lost Tribe of Israel.

    He’s a huge history buff so he has delved into the history of his warrior race lineage makes sense why he went into special forces, literally in his blood.

    Funny isn’t it though the US was the haven from persecution the place everyone wanted to get to if they could, and now is the place of persecution. My line came here through the Appalachians, I’ve been there btw, the only place I’ve ever seen an Outhouse race. The mountains are something, so strange because at the higher elevations you hear nothing, no sounds from animals or birds and very few insects.

  34. CD Marshall says:

    Joseph ever hear of the Schuster-Schwarzchild radiative transfer equation? I’m sure you have is it jusnk science or just abused by climate clowns?

  35. Joseph E Postma says:

    It is abused, OF COURSE. These liars just abuse everything. They love to get down into arcane aspects where they can pretend expertise.

    They begin with flat Earth, where the Sun doesn’t heat the Earth or create the climate. They invent reverse heat flow from there to attempt to make up for that error. QED. That’s it, that’s all.

  36. CD Marshall says:

    This is what I got from it…
    http://www.thermopedia.com/content/128/

  37. Joseph E Postma says:

    So it’s used for paint and how paint diffuses/reflects off of paint…lol.

    You see? How these morons just make stuff up? You have to give them credit for the things they will come up with, pretending they know anything about them.

    They begin with flat Earth, where the Sun doesn’t heat the Earth or create the climate. They invent reverse heat flow from there to attempt to make up for that error. QED. That’s it, that’s all.

    Just laugh at them for having to go to the equations for PAINT reflectivity to try to defend flat Earth theory…lol.

  38. Joseph E Postma says:

    how light diffuses

  39. CD Marshall says:

    How are they using that for radiative heat transfer in the atmosphere??? That was from an actual physicist and I’m sure a PhD. In fact I’ll just ask him.

  40. Look at what scientists think they should be doing with their time and funding:

    https://science.ucalgary.ca/geoscience/about/tom-oliver-series

    “Carbon Mineralization for CO2 Removal from Air and Permanent Storage”

  41. They now believe that they have to permanently remove CO2 from the atmosphere. Because of flat earth theory.

  42. CD Marshall says:

    Yeah so they are using that equation (and variations) to model radiative heat transfer. From Harvard:

    Click to access AbookC10.pdf

  43. Barry says:

    Quite amazing isn’t it that our co2 levels are finally getting back to a healthy level and now we would like to get rid of it. Maybe one day we can completely eliminate it or keep it at 140 ppm,just below the threshold for life. Greta will be ecstatic!

  44. And heat still doesn’t flow from cold to hot…

  45. Exactly Barry. What they’re proposing is truly evil.

  46. Leon says:

    Joseph,
    Going over your videos to send to a relative. Which would you suggest to start with?

  47. Almost any of them are good. The AMS video would work.

  48. Leon says:

    Well, he’s a pastor with a church. Not a sciency kind of guy so, baby steps. I can watch these videos and grasp almost everything seeing I’ve been researching this for about 4 years. But to an old man pastor… I’ll go with the greatest scientific fraud of all time. It’s only 20 min.

  49. Read this quote from “The Mandarin Effect: The Crisis of Meaning” by Joe Dixon –

    “No one else can be blamed for the failure of the education system than the education system itself, and in particular the education establishment, the Mandarin Elite. These people have made education painful and monstrous, not joyous and transformative. They have killed joy. They have turned education into the most boring undertaking possible rather than the most exciting. They should be fired en masse. Not a single one of them should be left to go on poisoning minds. There should be a total clearing out of the Mandarin class, and their total replacement by people who actually care about educating the people, rather than spouting tedious nonsense, like the Scholastic philosophers of old. (Actually, plenty of Scholasticism was philosophy of the highest order, unlike the nonsense of today.) By making education so repulsive, the Mandarin establishment have dumbed down the world to a staggering degree, destroyed humanity’s natural love of learning, and sent the masses in droves towards mind numbing drivel such as mass entertainment, mass consumerism, sport, reality TV, “dumbphones”, social media, and so on. No one has damaged the intellectual agenda more than those in charge of it, a bunch of autistic freaks with no clue about how humans work. The worst people to be in charge of the education system are those in charge of the education system. That’s humanity for you. Every dork, geek, and nerd from far and wide has been assembled to bore normal kids to death.”

    Start reading this book for free: https://a.co/aWLPqCB

  50. Leon says:

    Wait a second….
    if -18 is supposed to be an “average” and +15 is supposed to be an “average”, then why is 33C a de facto number? Don’t they say ghg provides 33C as a hard number? I don’t think I’ve read that 33 is an average ever. I could be wrong but this just occurred to me.

    I have another one. Correct me if I’m wrong but it’s as obvious to me as flat earth math is obvious to you. They say “No, co2 is not violating the 2nd, the warm surface still warms the atmos, it’s the net flux that counts”. I believe they calculate downwelling – upwelling. Well….In order to increase the NET of the surface, and seeing this is a function of subtraction, downwelling must decrease.
    Follow me here. To get a net increase after taxes, you would have to pay less tax than the previous year. So in order to get a net increase on the surface, the atmosphere flux must be less and less. Am I on to something here?

  51. CD Marshall says:

    A follow up with radiative forcing video would fit perfectly in this series and uncover one of the biggest misdirect ions in science aside from flat earth theory. In fact its so harebrained I’d love to know who originated this idea. I wonder if this is another Hansen sleight of hand?

    Once you’d learned enough rudimentary science forcing is so prosperous in the atmosphere as climate science dictates the process its something children could be taught correctly in the 5th grade.

  52. CD Marshall says:

    Joseph this idea came from Solving Politics, but you should have a debate with an empty chair next to you with the name Roy Spencer on it and explain he refused to debate you so you’ll debate an empty chair instead. LOL hilarious.

    He didn’t use Roy though, I did. He just said if you invite and they never show give the chair the name. Too bad you couldn’t switch cameras back and forth or something.

  53. CD Marshall says:

    On “What is Heat transfer” Primonome Ultimonome needs your attention. I’m not sure where he is coming from, so maybe talk to him yourself and settle his confusions or concerns as you deem fit.

  54. Joseph E Postma says:

    “if -18 is supposed to be an “average” and +15 is supposed to be an “average”, then why is 33C a de facto number? Don’t they say ghg provides 33C as a hard number? I don’t think I’ve read that 33 is an average ever. I could be wrong but this just occurred to me.”

    That’s a good point and insight! WHEN is it 33C? WHERE is it 33C?

    This goes entirely to the point that physics does not function as temporal and often-not spatial averages. The average is NOT WHAT EXISTS. And of course, that is entirely what they base their foundations upon: averages, that don’t actually physically exist anywhere or anytime. That’s what makes these “global energy budgets” fiction!

    “They say “No, co2 is not violating the 2nd, the warm surface still warms the atmos, it’s the net flux that counts”.”

    That’s just word-salad sophistry. They impose this word “net” into the discussion as if it makes a difference. They say: “Heat flows both ways, but the net heat is from hot to cold.” You see how that works? So all radiation is heat, and there is also this “net” heat that is from hot to cold, but heat still flows both ways. It is pure sophistry. Just pure shit. They mis-use the word “net”…or just make up what they want it to mean. The heat flow equation shows a “net”, i.e. the difference of two terms, as you know. Q = s(Th^4 – Tc^4). THAT is the net…Q (heat) IS the net. So then they say that both Th and Tc terms are heat, and also Q as the net is the heat too. It is really just pure sophistry.

    “Follow me here. To get a net increase after taxes, you would have to pay less tax than the previous year. So in order to get a net increase on the surface, the atmosphere flux must be less and less. Am I on to something here?”

    Yes sure, basically. It’s their misuse of the term “net”. They’re just inventing word salad with it.

  55. (when I comment without being logged in…it seems my own comments are now not being notified via email?? and also sometimes eaten??)

    “if -18 is supposed to be an “average” and +15 is supposed to be an “average”, then why is 33C a de facto number? Don’t they say ghg provides 33C as a hard number? I don’t think I’ve read that 33 is an average ever. I could be wrong but this just occurred to me.”

    That’s a good point and insight! WHEN is it 33C? WHERE is it 33C?

    This goes entirely to the point that physics does not function as temporal and often-not spatial averages. The average is NOT WHAT EXISTS. And of course, that is entirely what they base their foundations upon: averages, that don’t actually physically exist anywhere or anytime. That’s what makes these “global energy budgets” fiction!

    “They say “No, co2 is not violating the 2nd, the warm surface still warms the atmos, it’s the net flux that counts”.”

    That’s just word-salad sophistry. They impose this word “net” into the discussion as if it makes a difference. They say: “Heat flows both ways, but the net heat is from hot to cold.” You see how that works? So all radiation is heat, and there is also this “net” heat that is from hot to cold, but heat still flows both ways. It is pure sophistry. Just pure shit. They mis-use the word “net”…or just make up what they want it to mean. The heat flow equation shows a “net”, i.e. the difference of two terms, as you know. Q = s(Th^4 – Tc^4). THAT is the net…Q (heat) IS the net. So then they say that both Th and Tc terms are heat, and also Q as the net is the heat too. It is really just pure sophistry.

    “Follow me here. To get a net increase after taxes, you would have to pay less tax than the previous year. So in order to get a net increase on the surface, the atmosphere flux must be less and less. Am I on to something here?”

    Yes sure, basically. It’s their misuse of the term “net”. They’re just inventing word salad with it.

  56. re: forcing

    Well yes…they’ve invented this entire idea that cold forces hot to become hotter…yes that is the entire schtick. That’s why they call it that: “forcing”. That’s why they now try to say that ALL TERMS in the equation Q = s(Th^4 – Tc^4) are heat, and also that Q is the net heat (whatever that would now mean…haha).

  57. I replied to Primonome Ultimonome…and then “muted” them. Not sure if that muting) actually does anything.

  58. CD Marshall says:

    This is a perfect example from a troll who loves Skeptical Science and thus by association, pseudo science.

    “So now we have the conspiracy theory crap regarding SS. The greenhouse effect is being observed by satellites, land based instruments and scientists. The greenhouse effect does not break the 2nd law of thermodynamics. I found a few explanations from other sources than SS:

    Ian Miller, Physical organic chemist and theoretician “So far, there are no violations of the second law and I don’t expect any. People who claim such violations inevitably are found to have made sloppy logic. Without knowing why you asked this question, it is impossible to inform you of the problem.

    Perhaps one issue that confuses people is that the upper atmosphere is colder than the ground, and the back-radiation is alleged to heat the ground, and a cold object cannot heat a warmer one. The problem is the excited state of the greenhouse gas is in a higher vibrational state and that involves energy, not heat. It must move to a lower energy state, so it radiates a photon. That radiation does not warm the ground in the usual sense, but it excites the oscillators in the ground, which give off the grey body radiation, so what happens is the ground is not warmed, but it cools less quickly. The effect is similar to putting a blanket on your bed. The blanket does not heat you, but it slows your cooling.”

    Peter Upton, BA Physics & Mathematics, The Open University “The second law of thermodynamics states that the total entropy of an isolated system can never decrease over time. If you want to argue that the greenhouse effect contradicts this law and that the entropy does decrease. First problem is that you need an isolated system- this must include the sun, the earth and seeing as a lot of radiation from the earth heads off into space, the rest of the universe. Then you need to show that the entropy of the universe is decreasing, which it clearly isn’t.
    Short answer- they dont/ it is nonsense.”

    Jim Griepenburg, chemist “They don’t!! the incoming radiation is of higher energy photons; the outgoing radiation is of lower energy photons. Energy in = energy out; there are more photons of lower energy leaving so entropy has increased. If one thinks about it at a constant T the overall change in energy is ZERO. Therefore the only thing that drives the Earth is the difference in ENTROPY between the incoming and outgoing radiation. The greenhouse effect simply establishes the blackbody temperature of the Earth. Increase the greenhouse gas concentration the temperature of the Earth must increase. We can tinker a bit with reasonable effects but the idea of unlimited energy should horrify everyone because it means unlimited heat.”

    David Rosen, PhD Physics & Solid State, City University of New York Graduate Center (1985) “The greenhouse effect does not contradict the second law of thermodynamics.Black body radiation of high temperature, the sun, is turned into black body radiation of low temperature, the ambient air. Thus, the total entropy increases even with the greenhouse effect. Total entropy even increases with life. The second law of thermodynamics is not violated by any process on a macroscopic scale.”

  59. Leon says:

    CD,
    There’s a video floating around where a ‘well known’ climate scientist combines both adiabatic pressure AND forcing together in one swooping statement. Paraphrasing “As you increase height, the loss is 6.5 degrees per km but as you increase co2, the ceiling becomes higher. Conversely, the lower you go, the temperature increases. Say, an extra km is added to the co2 height, this means it would be 6.5 degrees warmer at the surface”
    I’ll see if I can find it.

  60. @CD – all the usual side-distraction arguments missing the point of their very own foundation: the sun doesn’t heat the Earth or create the climate, the atmosphere heats the Earth with twice the power of the Sun, heat must be implied to be flowing from cold to hot to make those other premises work. That’s the fact…those are the facts, those are their positions. They just like to pretend that they have some other position when their actual position is pointed out to them. They deny having any opinion on things at all, in the end, because they deny their own positions as it suits them.

  61. @Elon – yes that’s the radiative ceiling argument…the tropospheric hot-spot argument. The hot spot was checked for and it doesn’t exist. And other have shown that it is not a function of composition, but only total mass.

  62. Leon says:

    Here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hUFOuoD3aHw&t=414s
    Start at 9:30 and he makes the goof around 12:30

  63. CD Marshall says:

    Yes we’ve seen that video quite a bit here, it’s ripe with errors all the way through it. The thing is he’s smart enough to know he’s lying and at some points he almost looks guilty he’s doing it.

  64. Leon says:

    “he almost looks guilty he’s doing it.”

    Ha ha he does doesn’t he? He gives a subtle pause. I’ve challenged him there a few times but of course no reply.

  65. boomie789 says:

    “None of this is controversial, the physics are well understood”

    Then moves on to the old lukewarmers vs alarmist paradigm. Were you can argue forever meaninglessly. You are already on their track playing their game by their made up rules.

    Reminds me of Conservatives vs Democrats. Are we in their same constructed paradigm here as well? Were no matter what you do you can’t win, because it was rigged from the start.

  66. boomie789 says:

  67. J Cuttance says:

    Where can I get In the Cold Light of Day? Amazon only seems to have a Kindle version.

  68. For some reason the Kindle & paperback versions aren’t linked. Here is the paperback link:

    Cheers J Cuttance!

  69. J Cuttance says:

    wrong link but I got there, that exchange rate to the NZ lira ouch

  70. Mack says:

    Wow, that book of yours, Joe. Is it your first book? How do you get such heresy published. Who is your publisher with such cajones? How is the promotion achieved?…..with difficulty, I presume.
    Contact me…. I’m considering writing a book…. just one… title…. IT’S THE SUN, STUPID.

  71. Mack says:

    OK, I fired that comment off without looking it up. I see it was your first book.. and Amazon published them. Along with all the other sceptic books… Tim Ball, etc. …contact me none the less.

  72. boomie789 says:

    Dr Roger Hodkinson.

  73. CD Marshall says:

    Faint Sun Paradox:
    “Astrophysical studies indicate that the luminosity of the Sun was much lower during Earth’s early history than it has been in the Phanerozoic. In fact, radiative output was low enough to suggest that all surface water on Earth should have been frozen solid during its early history, but evidence shows that it was not. The solution to this “faint young Sun paradox” appears to lie in the presence of unusually high concentrations of greenhouse gases at the time, particularly methane and carbon dioxide. As solar luminosity gradually increased through time, concentrations of greenhouse gases would have to have been much higher than today. This circumstance would have caused Earth to heat up beyond life-sustaining levels. Therefore, greenhouse gas concentrations must have decreased proportionally with increasing solar radiation, implying a feedback mechanism to regulate greenhouse gases. One of these mechanisms might have been rock weathering, which is temperature-dependent and serves as an important sink for, rather than source of, carbon dioxide by removing sizable amounts of this gas from the atmosphere. Scientists are also looking to biological processes (many of which also serve as carbon dioxide sinks) as complementary or alternative regulating mechanisms of greenhouse gases on the young Earth.”

  74. boomie789 says:

    If Trump wins, the left is going to riot and burn down our cities and harass, even kill Trump supporters in the streets.

    If Biden wins, a very large portion of society is going to have the realization that their vote truly doesn’t matter. There will be no political solution.

    Not to mention the lockdowns and vaccinations.

    Seems though somebody up there is on our side. The fraud is evident for everyone to see. There is no doubt in my mind that this election is an ongoing coup attempt. They weren’t able to hide it from us. That is the silver lining. I’m grateful for that at least.

  75. boomie789 says:

    Must watch

  76. CD Marshall says:

    Glaciers are melting! Yeah but…
    How old is glacier ice?
    “The age of the oldest glacier ice in Antarctica may approach 1,000,000 years old. The age of the oldest glacier ice in Greenland is more than 100,000 years old The age of the oldest Alaskan glacier ice ever recovered (from a basin between Mt. Bona and Mt. Churchill) is about 30,000 years old.” -USGS (U.S. Geological Survey)

    So we have had glaciers that have survived 10 interglacials and a full Ice Age Cycle wich is very impressive.

    “The last four interglacials lasted over ~20,000 years with the warmest portion being a relatively stable period of 10,000 to 15,000 years duration.”

    We are only 11,600 years into his one but estimated 15k the warming declines.

  77. Ross Handsaker says:

    CD – regarding glaciers.
    Perhaps also interesting is the age of some of the Northern Hemisphere glaciers, eg the Fremont Glacier in Wyoming is only around 300 years old while the Hans Tausen Ice Gap in northern Greenland is no more than 4000 years old.This would suggest it was much warmer than today in those areas during the current interglacial.

  78. CD Marshall says:

    Ross Handsaker
    Excellent points and is supported by previous warming periods, but like today it’s not global as they claim. Regional anomalies would produce local phenomenon, such as increasing glaciers at one place and receding glaciers at another. They pervert science by using “global” for everything. When an actual “global” event does happen no one will care.

    Have you see this?
    https://www.researchgate.net/project/Mapping-the-Medieval-Climate-Anomaly

    https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer?mid=1akI_yGSUlO_qEvrmrIYv9kHknq4&ll=-3.81666561775622e-14%2C38.03818700000005&z=1

  79. Zelator says:

    Flipping Heck! Cartoon News Network caught red handed? Were they aware of the switch? Complicit?

    I tell you what, if Trump overturns this situation, ( because, as of now their has been no decision about the result, only claims made by the media), then the Fake Stream Media and DNC are in shit street. How can a countries media and political infrastructure ( well worldwide as it’s being reported
    following suit with the US Media ) be complicit in such a huge corruption against the people survive?

    There has to be jailing of culprits and instigators, firings, public castigation and even execution for treason for such huge crimes. This is massive!

    If this is proven true, then this will be the Sting of the Century.

  80. Zelator says:

    And the demons the djinn perform their majick in front of your eyes…

    So the devil cheats the world:

  81. Zelator says:

    They tell us who they are, as they always do, they do this to mock us; words are chosen carefully, there is power in the word.
    There are no coincidences, everything is chosen for its intended purpose and the energy it holds.

    Ephesians 6:12, NIV: “For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities,
    against the powers of this dark world and against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms.”

    Dominions: Fallen Angels or as we call them Archons.

  82. CD Marshall says:

    I still want to know why they feel the need to cover up giants as actually existing? Someone had a lot of influence to make that disappear and replace it with evolution as the holy grail to species.

    The even weirder thing about it is folklore said them be the offspring of ‘fallen angels’.

    Don’t know about that part but they have records of giants in the bible and they gave them height measurements the tallest was King Og I think? Who was said to be the last of his line of true giants, and the bed they laid him on was like 12-13 feet our measurements.

    All lands had tales of giants. Dinosaurs existed why not larger humanoids?

    I think it was the Mayans maybe told of “watchers” or “guardians” who came across the ocean in giant rafts and become kings of city states (or regions not sure anymore). They were said to be giants with great knowledge and wisdom and lived may lives of men.

    Considering ancient tech they keep finding is far more advanced than they had anticipated it has baffled them. Even the ability to fly perhaps not as we see see it but they found a way. Maybe balloons weren’t such a new invention?

    I don’t know but I’d love to be able to see in the past and prove these things once and for all true or false.

    You know the Aztecs had horns so intricately carved they simulated the sound of jaguars perfectly. Something this day can only be duplicated with 3-D printers “if” I have my facts right. Maybe not?

  83. boomie789 says:

    I want to know what all those weird skulls that have been found are all about.

    And there is more to them than just skull forming/molding from a young age. At least that Is what I think. Those skulls were full of a huge brain is my understanding. Significantly larger than normal. Also the bones that that up the skull are different.

  84. boomie789 says:

    *Also the bones that make up the skull are different.

  85. CD Marshall says:

    Isn’t obvious those are skulls from Alien. Makes me want to watch AVP. You know come to think of it, Alien was a weird name for that movie but it worked and stuck. I guess xenomorph would have been too much for the time period?

    So many things from ancient cultures they simply discard because they don’t want to recognize maybe evolution wasn’t as evolved as they believed/de-evolution might be possible as well.

  86. boomie789 says:

    I don’t know if it’s aliens. Apparently the latest DNA on them says they have Aryan and middle eastern DNA. Keep in mind they were found in Peru.

    But you are right in that there is this evolution narrative that seems be be treated as gospel. Like they already figured it out and any evidence to the contrary is ignored or made to fit.

  87. boomie789 says:

  88. boomie789 says:

    Skip to around 40 minutes and watch for a little while.

  89. Zelator says:

    Shit or bust. What does Trump and his lawyers have? Big players putting their reputations on the line.
    He is lining his big guns up in states for the recounts. Look who is now in charge of PA, WI, MI, and GA

    Circuit Courts have been Reassigned:

    Effective November 20, 2020, ordered pursuant to Title 28, United States Code, Section 42

    MI – Brett M. Kavanaugh
    WI – Amy Coney Barrett
    PA – Samuel A. Alito
    GA – Clarence Thomas

    Think of The Godfather 1 , all business is sorted.

    This is the best live poker game ever witnessed in the history of the world?

    The alphabet agencies are implicated, is this the biggest sting of the century? Is the shit show about to be exposed; is the house of cards about to fall? Come on Donald pull the plug on the swamp once and for all. We’ve planned this from day 1. Lets do it!

    http://www.whatdoesitmean.com/index3399.htm

  90. CD Marshall says:

    Joseph,
    Another physicist, Barton Paul Levenson, claims he’ll debate over CC
    His words, “Are you a physicist? Do you have any expertise at climate science? Not all physicists do, in case you didn’t know. BTW, yes, I am confident that what I claim is actually true, since it’s been the scientific consensus since 1956 and the evidence for it is overwhelming.”

    I replied, “Not I good sir, you’ll be debating Joseph Postma, an astrophysicist whose very clear on his stance to the consensus science. So naturally, he can keep up.”

    Still waiting for a reply.

  91. CD Marshall says:

    Odd he was quick to reply when he thought he was debating me so far nothing back after he found out it was you…Maybe he’s looking into you first?

  92. CD Marshall says:

    Joseph thought you’d find this amusing…

  93. Well let’s see if he responds.

  94. CD Marshall says:

    Well still hasn’t responded nothing but crickets. I’m guessing your reputation proceeds you. He sounded so confident didn’t he?

    Until he wasn’t.

  95. boomie789 says:

    Should record it and post it.

  96. CD Marshall says:

    That info I got from the US Geological Survey on glaciations is gone now! As I went back it just vanished into “a bad gateway”. Everything else is still there but that.

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