The Fraud of the AGHE Part 17: Watts are not a unit of Energy, and how the IPCC Violates Conservation of Energy

Who are we Working With?

Skip down to the next heading section if a cathartic discussion about stupid people doesn’t appeal to you.

After my last two posts, I actually had some raging moron alarmist challenge me “to take the chart in your post (what you call the IPCC energy budget) and replace all of the numbers with what you believe are the correct values”.

Is anyone else catching up with me here at just how retarded these kind of people are? This whole thing is not an issue of simply needing to communicate the correct science and then people will understand and get on board – no – these people are mentally retarded, they have brain damage, they are higher-functioning animals governed by their R-Complex and Limbic System rather than their Neocortex, they will actually argue with you whether or not 1 + 1 = 2, and then in the end they hate themselves via their sheer narcissism and wish for political policies which will hurt themselves and other people because even though the policies hurt themselves, they can live with such policies for their perceived benefit of being able to witness and live amongst examples of unjust irrational force harming other, innocent people. That is what these retards get out of it, if you haven’t figured it out yet: they get their sick disgusting deranged enjoyment of watching people be harmed and be forced to do things and believe things they would otherwise never do. That is what creates a climate alarmist…they’re mentally disturbed, deranged, sick people, sociopathic and even psychopathic in nature, who have not a single thread of contact with reality outside of their internal narcissism nihilism complex. Their goal is to create harm, they seek to witness an “infinite power” (government and/or religion) punish innocent humans (people consuming cheap energy to live); they are dominance and submission sadomasochists of the highest order, people seeking to materially manifest on the outside, their bicameral minds.

These people “lose their shit” when you inform them that -400C isn’t hot enough to melt ice into water, let alone evaporate water and create clouds and drive the climate. They do all sort of crazy things like wrap light-bulbs in tin foil to try to prove that -400C can melt ice. I want you, the reader, if you’re mentally sane, to imagine yourself into the mind of such a person, and comprehend just how disturbed, deranged, detached from reality, endarkened, and malevolent such “dark entities” are. Their minds have no light in them whatsoever. (Maybe that’s why they wrap light-bulbs with tin foil?) It is like experiencing a void…but it is a void of malevolence to light, to any form of knowledge. It is a malevolence that harms and contradicts itself instead of ever letting any light into itself; it will harm itself if it means that it simultaneously gets to witness the same harm being perpetrated against someone else who didn’t deserve it. It values harm being done unto others more than it might seek to avoid harm being done unto itself. We’re talking about a machine here…something that has been programmed, that isn’t human, and which doesn’t have a soul, some artificial construct that was never supposed to exist, some cosmic mistake. It is fundamentally incapable of distinguishing truth between concepts, and for “truth” it must defer to the consensus of others rather than its own intelligence, since it has no intrinsic intelligence of its own.

You’ll see people being animated by this machine all around you, and their greatest concentration exists in climate alarm and climate warmism, and anyone who maintains belief in the greenhouse effect even after they’ve been shown how ridiculous it is. Such people shrink to the consensus of others rather than ever forming or holding an independent thought, because it frightens them, and they manifestly and will directly state to you that they cannot possibly imagine how a single person could ever have or create an independent thought which is superior to their perceived currently existing consensus of one group-brand (alarmism) or another (luke-warmism).

The concept itself, of an independent thought, eludes them! The abstraction of independent thinking is an unknown mystery to them. They can not imagine – and they outright tell you this all the time – the concept of a single individual forming or holding an independent thought which is better than the mass denominator of some group or another. This is the old “you really think you know better than the ‘consensus’?” argument which you get every single time you engage in debate, in some form or another. It always gets used, they can do nothing but use it. It’s the only thing they can use. You have to realize that what they’re telling you is that THEY have no ability to form an independent thought, and that they have never encountered, ever, a truly conscious self-created thought, that came out of their neocortex.  Because they’ve never encountered this before within their own mind, the abstraction of it occurring in another mind is neither here nor there.  I can see nothing but this blackness of stupidity, when I meditate upon imagining what their mental phase-space must be like.  Could you imagine if the only thoughts that you could form or hold circulating in your “conscious awareness”, were thoughts which a group of people already formed for you, and whichever group you “chose” to have as the one you followed was determined for reasons you’ve never understood, and you can’t even understand if the thoughts are good for you (let alone society) or not?  Could you imagine that you have to go to the length of denying that photosynthesis between sunlight and carbon dioxide exists, in order to maintain your group-obedience?

Is that not amazing, in some way?  Just witness these people sometime, when you get a chance; carefully watch the faces they make, when you demonstrate independent thinking, verbally, around them.  You’ll witness the strangest facial expressions – masks hiding an untold incredulity of idiocy behind them.  You’ll be thinking, “Wow, now that’s a lot of stupidity behind that mask, all concentrated into one place!”.  You’ll start to recognize it more and more.  It’s almost negentropic, because generally that density of stupidity shouldn’t be able to concentrate in one place without having done a lot of work to get it there.  Thank mass-media and simulacra for that. Do you know that where I work, in academia, these type of people watch poop-joke videos at lunch time? They watch YouTube videos on the big TV in the conference room, of monkeys smelling their butts and falling out of trees, or of kids “sacking” themselves with skateboards or from falling off of a bike doing a jump… “Fail Compilations”, I think these are called. They HOWL at this stuff.  Howl at it. I should put up great big, bright and loud, advertisement boards for Brawndo in that room.

Look it’s not that I mind being stupid or Dionysian every now and again.  Few of us are perfect and we’ve all been there…when we were adolescents.  It’s just that when it’s permanent, and when it is impenetrable to reason, that it becomes a problem.

Do you get how insane this world is, when a highly trained scientist can’t publish or talk to other “scientists” about the temperature required to melt ice? I don’t give a darn about ostracism – it is the insanity that moves me to action to fight against it. And unfortunately, therein lies the reason for the existence of this dark entity. That’s just the way the current boundary conditions have been set up, and few people remain free to rebel against it. You can figure out the dialectic here and what overcoming it is meant to lead to 🙂

This was my reply to the fellow asking for another IPCC energy budget with “the correct values”:

To even ask this question is to indicate that you do not understand the problem with the supposed physics of the greenhouse effect and IPCC energy budget.

It is NOT POSSIBLE to create such a diagram with the correct numbers. If you attempt it, the numbers will not correspond to anything regarding reality, for the reasons which have been proven and demonstrated. The diagram can only be a fiction, and any numbers created for it can only be a fiction.

Secondly, did you not read the article? There, you do have a diagram that shows how the physics is actually supposed to work, with correct numbers!

The Sun creates the water cycle, and the IPCC and all other greenhouse energy budgets contradict that basic fact. Hence, they are wrong. Climate change alarm based on the greenhouse effect is a fraud. It’s quite simple if you understand what ice is.

Of course, in science, if you’re being the slightest bit rational and you have the slightest comprehension of how the method is supposed to work, you do not need to have a replacement model to stanchion a debunk of an existing theory.  In any case, there is that too.

What is Energy?

Not “Watt is energy”.  In physics, and what should be everywhere else in anything calling itself science, what is the unit of energy?  The unit of energy has a name, and it is called a Joule, after English physicist James Prescott Joule.  A Joule, or Joules, are the unit of energy in science.  There are other equivalent metrics for energy such as “ergs” or “electron volts” but they are all equivalent to a certain number of Joules.

Watts, on the other hand, are a unit of flux.  In particular, the temporal flux of Joules, meaning the number of Joules being “used” or “passing by” in one second.  The fundamental definition and unit of a Watt is a Joule per second, so, W = J/s where the letters abbreviate the relevant quantities.  So, one Watt is one Joule of energy used in one particular second.  We call this flux.

When we get to radiation or light, and the measure of its strength, these are measured in Watts per square meter, which means Joules per second per square meter, and this is called flux density.  It is a number of Joules, being used each second, over the area of a square meter. W/m2 = J/s/m2.  These are the units for the Stefan-Boltzmann Equation which is the single equation that exists for converting radiation, or light, into temperature.  Why I mean by that is that the equation tells you the temperature of the light given its intensity, or conversely, the intensity of the light given its temperature.  The equation tells you that light has a direct equivalence to temperature, just like mass has a direct equivalence to energy.  The latter equation is Einstein’s E = mc2, which shows that mass has an equivalence to energy. Likewise, radiation has an equivalence to temperature via the Stefan-Boltzmann equation, which is F = σT4, where F is the Flux density of the radiation, σ is a constant, and T is the temperature.

So then what’s wrong with the IPCC energy budget?  Let’s have a look at it again:

IPCC Budget

What they’re doing to get this thing to “work”, is adding together the flux densities of light.  Given the Stefan-Boltzmann equation which shows us that light flux density has an equivalence to temperature, then what this diagram is doing is adding temperatures together, to make it work.  When it adds 168 J/s/m2 from sunlight with 324 J/s/m2 from the atmosphere, it is saying that sunlight is -400C and that the atmosphere is 1.80C (because that is the equivalent temperature of those light flux densities), and that if you add together something that is -400C to something that’s +1.80C, you get +150C. Not just that – the diagram tries to say that air is hotter than sunlight!

Only in academic science and in luke-warmism and alarmism, do you find people who think that adding something that is cold (-400C) to something that is warmer (1.80C) will make the warmer thing warmer still.  This isn’t because they’re smart, but it is because modern science has failed and it has failed society.

It is still totally true and totally smart to understand that adding an ice-cube to a hot cup of coffee doesn’t make the coffee hotter.  All normal, sane, working-class people understand this.  Only the welfare-state scientists and luke-warmist blog writers who can’t actually do an honest day of labour, let alone thinking, are confused about adding temperatures.  By extension they must also think that adding two ice-cubes together should make something hotter than either original ice-cube…this is a direct and literal inference of their beliefs.

You can add energy, but you can not add energy flux density and temperatures.  Energy flux density is another animal entirely and especially in terms of its relation to temperature, it does not just add together like simple energy does.

Energy itself is a very simple and abstract concept; it quantifies something we call action or the potential for action, but the energy itself is not quantified until you also specify in how much time it will be used and over what volume or area of space and matter.  That is what flux and flux density does to quantify the physical effect energy, and in terms of radiation (light energy) the physical effect of energy on matter is temperature.  You cannot get a higher temperature than the single hottest temperature; lower temperatures can not add to higher temperatures and so lower flux densities do not add to higher flux densities to create higher temperature.

Balancing Energy, not Watts

What they want to do is create a diagram that conserves energy.  Instead, they create a diagram that conserves energy flux density and then they mix in the mistake of distributing that flux over a surface area that it never falls upon, and make all the mistakes which have been discussed at length previously.  It makes them think that the sun is freezing cold and that the atmosphere provides almost twice the energy of the Sun, etc. (Again, welfare-scientist eggheads that have no connection to reality, because ANY other normal person knows there is a problem there.)

Their basic premise is that if an “average” for the planet Earth exists, then any particular second of time should be indistinguishable from any other particular second of time, and any particular location on the planet should be indistinguishable from any other particular location on the planet.

Well, first of all, the “average of the system” is an abstraction and it does not actually exist. Secondly, each particular second of time IS distinguishable from any other particular second of time.  And third, each particular location on the planet IS distinguishable from any other particular location on the planet.  It’s called weather and geography, day and night, etc.  Isn’t it kind of surprising that welfare-state scientists don’t understand that, that they literally can’t comprehend the scientific and mathematical importance of…FACTS?  That you can’t just average it all together?

What are the units of the intensity of light?  We’ve just seen this, they are Joules per second per square meter.  That means that the effect that light has on matter does depend on WHEN and WHERE the light is falling.  When is the “per second”, and where is the “per square meter”.  Therefore, if you want to make an “energy budget” diagram that correctly balances energy flux density, you have to make a diagram that looks like this:

zoomed in reality

Of course we’ve seen this diagram lots of times on here.  When you do it this way, then the energy flux density of sunlight DOES have the real power it actually has and can make you feel very warm and can melt ice into water and evaporate water into vapour etc. etc., instead of being -400C, and you would never imagine something like the atmosphere being hotter than sunlight and providing twice as much energy as the sun does.

Conservation of Energy

The attempt of the IPCC energy budget is to balance energy, but since the only energy source is the Sun, then how is it possible that the atmosphere emits twice the energy of the Sun?  First, they incorrectly try to balance energy flux density instead of energy, and in terms of energy flux density, they do it wrong, by ignoring the units of energy flux density. Second, their scheme results in the atmosphere emitting twice the energy of the Sun, which is a violation of conservation of energy because how can it emit more than comes in?

Well yes as we all know, these people are raging idiots.  Actually, they’re purposeful liars.  Either way, malevolence is stupid and stupidity is malevolent.  Napoleon would have liked that solution, and I’m surprised Heinlein didn’t realize it before I did.  I don’t mean “innocent stupidity” which we all have because if we’re here we don’t know everything yet, but “purposeful stupidity”, the kind that insists upon itself, such as described in my rant above.  Initially they are difficult or impossible to distinguish.  Upon the attempt to correct, you will quickly determine if the stupidity is malevolent, or accidental.

Once you have a realistic diagram like that above, then you realize you have to go to a real-time, time and location dependent, form of mathematics and physics that can describe that.  Of course, as we have recently seen from a luke-warmist, let alone the alarmists, they don’t understand what that math or physics is.  They need some “God of the group consensus” to tell them what it is before they will believe it exists.

Comment on Welfare-State Scientists

I think that someone is trying to destroy the concept of the state, by taking it over and doing all sorts of ridiculous and irrational things with it.  We do need a state, and we’ve already been where a real state doesn’t exist.  Most people are “normal people” who mind their business and get on with life, don’t wish to fight, don’t wish to control others.  In that environment, psychopathic and sociopathic people who DO like to control and fight others have an open invitation to wreak their havoc on the society they live in.  They think it makes them “masters of the universe”, but really they’re just complete morons who don’t realize that none of us really care about fighting them, and that if we ever did chose to fight them, we would destroy them utterly in an instant.  Their only response to this is to ask “why don’t you then?”, which just goes to show how stupid they are because they can’t truly understand the other perspectives that have no wish nor care to harm or fight other people!  It just doesn’t matter to us.  But it means everything to them…because they’re psycho.

In any case, the state does serve the purpose of the people (it is supposed to) by protecting them from “kings and financial tyrants”.  And so of course, as many of you know, the kings and financial tyrants have taken over the state in order to use it to abuse and control people, and thus to make people hate the state, which just makes a lawless land where the tyrants still have the advantage they desire.  That was not what the USA, for example, was founded about, or for.

Of course, we all collectively benefit from roadways and waterway and energy development, etc., and I don’t think any sane person would want to go back to a time where all land is privately owned and any landowner can demand exorbitant tolls for crossing their land or section of river.  That would be an insane and totally unworkable system with the modern economy and technology and requirement for travel and transport, etc.

Climate Alarm is the vector that the “kings and financial tyrants” have used to 1) destroy the value of science, 2) make people hate science and diminish it, 3) control the rest of the fearful idiots who believe the simulacrum they’ve manufactured.  It is exactly what previous kings and financial tyrants of past millennia have done to 1) destroy the value of religion, 2) make people hate religion and diminish it, 3) control the rest of the idiots who actually believe the religion.  All of that was a direct template for what they’re doing with Climate Alarm now, and anyone with a good dose of rationality can identify the fanatical religious aspects of that alarm.  Believe in God or humanity will be condemned and die, right?  Believe in climate Alarm or we’ll all die, right?

The state can be rational and even as screwed up as it is now, many of the things it provides (through individuals working paid by taxes from other working individuals) are invaluable.  However, we do need to eventually destroy the kings and financial tyrants, because they will just keep creating irrationalism for their psychopathic enjoyment and keep destroying any value that normal sane people try to collectively create to collectively benefit from.  The psychopaths HATE IT when we do that.  They just hate it, when we individually and collectively create things for which all to collectively benefit from.  They hate any concept of society or state, and that’s why they take those over and abuse them and others with it.  The solution is NOT to get rid of the state, because that is exactly what would give the psychopaths, the kings and financial tyrants, ultimate freedom!  So, those people who think that that is the solution are wrong.  I mean how is that not obvious?  The solution is to have a sane state, and that means that eventually the sheep will have to become humans using their neocortex.

Note, in that last sentence, how I framed that.  The solution is not for the “sheep to become lions”, because that’s still limiting yourself to an animal, the rule of the jungle.  A lion eventually wants to become master of the pride, the king and tyrant.  The solution to fight the kings and tyrants is not to become equal kings and tyrants, i.e. better psychopaths.  Sane people enjoy other people being sane and happy too, and contributing, and living in a sane collective doing things which are collectively valuable to all of the individuals, etc.  Insane people (i.e. higher functioning animals) want to fight everyone else for the majority share of the resources and then to never let anyone else have any resources at all, if possible, and see no value in society or the collective or things that benefit other than “number 1”.

The collective isn’t scary, you guys (and you know who you are); what is scary is a world full of psychopaths lead by master psychopaths all trained by the master psycho’s to act and think like psycho’s fighting each other.  That’s not the only way of doing things.

The collective which any sane rational person doesn’t desire is the collective of the zombie, of the sheople.  The collective of the zombie, however, is the type of collective that the king and tyrant likes to create because this is the only type of collective which they can control and defeat!  That’s the collective which the anarcho-capitalists think of, and they seem unable to consider the rational alternative.  A collective of individuals, mentally informed people of individual and unique value and merit, rather than masses of celebrity-culture-obsessed drones, is a collective and state which was the intention of the founding of the USA and which any sane and rational person would like to live in.  And it has some social programs and public works and public land that benefit people.  In this type of collective, we would all massively benefit from each other and still be autonomous individuals. It simply wouldn’t require an obsession with selfishness and “screwing” the other guy. In the zombie collective of the tyrant, few of us benefit from each other, but that doesn’t mean that other sane people are impossible.  It just means we need to qualitatively change the boundary conditions.

The paradigm of competition for resources had its time and place, but that time should be over now and it could be if we really seriously rationally focused on development, and got rid of this stupid system of financial tyranny. We would have gotten there already, far ahead of where we are now, if it wasn’t for the financial tyranny that put the brakes on the development which had already been started.  Incidentally this is why the alarmists want to reduce the availability of fossil fuels, in order to manufacture a reduction in energy resources and thus maintain a cognitive pressure of such a competition in society.

Become HUMAN, which means your neocortex.  Become rational and stop tolerating stupidity.  If we did that, we wouldn’t even need to physically fight the tyrants…we would just move far past them and forget them, and then put them in zoos or something and study their behaviour for fun.

Anyway, the point is, state-funded science can work spectacularly well, like it did with the Apollo Program, Manhattan Project, building dams and waterways and reservoirs that span a nation, and many other examples.  Alarmism is all about destroying the concept of state science and the state itself, and that’s exactly what the financial tyrants intended.  It is also about devaluing science itself and teaching people bad science to make them a) stupid b) fearful, because such people make better drones.  And all of this currently rests on the greenhouse effect and climate alarm.

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35 Responses to The Fraud of the AGHE Part 17: Watts are not a unit of Energy, and how the IPCC Violates Conservation of Energy

  1. viffer says:


    In a standard atmosphere, at whatever elevation is represented in the Kiehl/Trenberth comic for their ‘back radiation’ (sorry, pissing myself laughing), do you think they are simply unaware that the T in σT^4 is a smaller number than the T at Mean Sea Level?

    Ergo, as elevation increases, the temperature reduces (in a standard atmosphere). This rate of temperature reduction is reduced in a saturated atmosphere; however, it nevertheless still cools as elevation increases. Why can so few people grasp this? A cooler sky can never cause an already warmer surface to become even warmer.

    Rocket science this is not. Fraud it definitely is. We need some prosecutions, to encourage the others, you understand.

    PS: If Kiehl/Trenberth/Pachuari/Gore etc are so clever, why haven’t they designed a ‘back radiation detector’ and sold it to every building owner on the planet to help reduce the building’s energy consumption? Why also don’t they put CO2 in double glazing cavities (rhetorical)?

  2. Bart says:

    Excellent Joe!!

    I was just thinking about the Apollo Program today and what can be accomplished when real science and sane people get together. I was also thinking of how sad it is that there is a general lack of interest today with such topics/projects. Try talking to a random person about the Apollo program nowadays and you’ll be sure to get glazed over eyes in a few moments. Then, try talking to someone about the idiotic new Miley Cyrus video………..their eyes will light up with interest and a smile will immediately come to their face. Not everyone………but generally, the majority of people these days would like to have a conversation about Miley Cyrus rather than anything important. God forbid you think about anything serious!! Also, don’t be surprised if you are berated for bringing up such a “boring” topic!!!!
    Sad!!…. and like I always say, to far gone I’m afraid….

  3. Truthseeker says:


    This perfectly explains the scalar versus vector comment I made in the previous thread. I will be referring the non-rant parts of this post in future.

    Despite some of the past successes of taxpayer funded science I think we need to totally defund all government science to do what would effectively be a “reset”. Let those who want to build stuff pay for the practical science that they need to actually do real things in the real world.

  4. That’s right Viffer, heat goes from hot to cold via conduction, diffusion, convection, and radiation, and never flows the opposite way or contributes to temperature in the opposite direction, ever. Introductory partial differential equations for heat flow in thermodynamics is ALL about that, and the source of heat is never heated further by the cooler thing the heat goes into…the equations simply don’t work like that.

  5. Hey Bart, yes indeed, people like you and I are an extremely rare breed today. Great example of people’s faces lighting up when you talk about Miley Cyrus vs. something important, lol. Does anyone else realize just how USELESS today’s society is? It has almost no value, whatsoever.

  6. Seeker, I think we could rationally gut the correct programs and redirect funding into truly productive ones – there is a rational way to fix it, rather than burning it ALL down. Just burn down the things which would be rational, and hence fun, to burn down. People like Trenberth, Mann, and the many other people supporting this fraud, should be stripped of their funding entirely and their jobs, and they should either go back through school starting at the undergraduate level, or get real jobs packing someones groceries. Trouble is, it IS the existing school system which failed these failures, so that’s needs to be fixed too, and there are rational ways to do that too.

  7. Truthseeker says:

    Joe, the problem of trying to keep the “truly productive ones” is that someone has to make that judgement, and how do you ensure that you have the right people to make that judgement.

    “Power corrupts” is the common wisdom that I think has been proven throughout history. I believe I have come up with a theory to back that observation. My theory is that everyone has an “integrity threshold” which is clearly higher for some people than others. If a person is given power that is below their integrity threshold, then everything works as it should. That person works within the defined parameters and does not exceed them. The more power you give people, the more likely you are going to exceed their integrity threshold and that is when the corruption sets in. That is why power should be distributed as widely as possible and why any sort of significant bureacracy tends towards corruption.

  8. Seeker, we can’t default to some premise that no one has a right to make a judgement, because then we’re either doing nothing or we’re letting those who use power to create judgement to continue doing so. I am more than capable of making rational judgments on a very wide field of the sciences. It comes down to VALUE. Can YOU identify value? I know I can. If no one has a right to make a judgement, then that means there is no such thing as value. But of course, there IS value, and we can identify it. Freedom is a value and the type of science that promotes freedom is valuable, for example. Development to higher standards of living is a value and the type of science that leads to that is identifiable and valuable. Rationality DOES EXIST. We can use our mind for universal good. The psychotic elite can’t.

    That is an interesting theory you have and I agree it would apply to a large fraction of the zombie sheople masses. But we also have this silly society improperly structured around a tyrannical money supply that makes people do silly irrational things. People CAN get together and do the right thing, especially if we had a sane financial system and un-hijacked government…you just need the right type of people, aka, ENGINEERS, and the type of physicists and other scientists who support engineers, instead of paper pushers and “eggheads”. Indeed, power should be distributed, but we also need smart, rational meritorious people with valuable visions to help lead things at the governmental level. Power can’t be so distributed that it is impossible to do anything. The US system was once a sane system for distributing power and within that it was still able to get amazing things done, like the Apollo Program, etc. And so yes it seems that the more the US system has collectivized power into the presidency, particularly like we see Obama trying to do, the LESS good has actually gotten done with it! Definitely agreed about bureaucracy and its evils.

  9. Derek Alker says:

    A Watt is a flux, flux density, rate, flow. Yup, got that. It is a doing type of thing, a sort of verb, in reality it MUST have time in it.

    A Joule is an amount. Yup got that.

    IR flux and temperature yup got that. If you add two flows of light together does the flow double in intensity? No, If you add two flows of water together does the speed of the flow double? Not necessarily, it depends on how the flow is restricted / contained.

    Government funded science, when it is needed, leads to politically lead and politically convenient pseudo-science. Yup, got that.

    Education PRODUCES the failures. Yup, got that. I could not pass almost any level of climate science exam. To pass an exam, which I could easily do, I would have to answer with what I know has been shown to be unphysical, politically convenient bull dung. I would also have to describe, as if real, a black body version of reality, that is totally imaginary.

    The best science IS amateur. Yup. got that.

    Who is Miley Cyrus? Seriously I have not a clue, but I do not want to know either.

    The American constitution / Libertarianism – It seems to me we must have forgotten a lot “we” learnt in the 1700s that meant the constitution was needed and drafted. Certainly in the UK libertarianism / liberty / the American constitution is simply not taught or mentioned.

    At present we have a reversal of what should happen. The bureaucrats of the UN are telling the politicians of the world how the people they represent must be controlled in their actions and every day lives to “save the planet”. In reality the planet is fine, and the people should be telling their politicians what the bureaucrats should be enforcing on the peoples behalf, yet the sheople can not see this reversal of what should happen. Libertarianism therefore is the answer, because you can not fool all of the people all of the time. Yup, got that.

  10. Allen Eltor says:

    One definitive description of this TYPE concept, is embodied in the non fiction work of literature called “The Peter Principle” by some guy, who concluded quite rationally, there is a threshold past which a person will not perform well.

    As long as he performs well, he gets promoted. WHEN HE STOPS BEING FULLY COMPETENT, he isn’t gotten RID of because he’s shown/invested, time: effort – commitment;

    and if possible he’s kept:


    It’s quite a fascinating look at hierarchy mechanics. “The Peter Principle.”

    Truthseeker says:
    2013/09/19 at 9:36 PM

    Joe, the problem of trying to keep the “truly productive ones” is that someone has to make that judgement, and how do you ensure that you have the right people to make that judgement.

    “Power corrupts” is the common wisdom that I think has been proven throughout history. I believe I have come up with a theory to back that observation. My theory is that everyone has an “integrity threshold” which is clearly higher for some people than others. If a person is given power that is below their integrity threshold, then everything works as it should. That person works within the defined parameters and does not exceed them. The more power you give people, the more likely you are going to exceed their integrity threshold and that is when the corruption sets in. That is why power should be distributed as widely as possible and why any sort of significant bureacracy tends towards corruption.

  11. johnmarshall says:

    Thanks Joe.
    Scientific research must go down two routes:-
    1) Private to achieve a cheaper, less energy consumptive product or system thus making more money. This also increases tax take for government to spend part on-

    2) Government funded research that has no obvious outcome but pure research. If no real outcome is envisaged then it would not start. Many of these ”blind” research routes have ended up with benefits never before imagined. Private organizations may not be able to afford this route.

    Keep up the good works Joe.

  12. ilma630 says:

    Joe, Just reading the NIPCC Summary for Policymakers, and there is the statement “IPCC Claim #1: A doubling of atmospheric CO2 would cause warming between 3°C and 6°C. The increase in radiative forcing produced by a doubling of atmospheric CO2 is generally agreed to be 3.7 Watts/m2” (Pg. 6), so my next task is to put that into the ‘Watts are not a unit of Energy’ context you explain above. My poor brain will get there (very tired after a 3-day trip to Belarus – which was quite eye-opening in a very different way), but no doubt it will 🙂

  13. Max™ says:

    I never manage to get anywhere when I point out that taking a number of Joules per second per square meter and averaging that same number of Joules across twice as many seconds and square meters gives a nonsensical result.

    I finally withdrew from engaging in those “debates” when I realized I fit a certain definition of insanity: repeating the same action while expecting a different outcome.

    Unfortunate, hard to admit for someone who loves teaching… but dogma and belief can not be defeated with something as banal as facts.

  14. Oooh that last sentence is SO quotable!

  15. From a Facebook comment (by “RJ”):

    Joe, I’ve complimented you on the rant, I should also praise the rest of your article. It is clear, logical, and well argued. But that raises this question: why are you and a handful of others the only ones arguing from basic physical principles that utterly refute the GHE and AGW? It seems that every physicist and engineer, and others with scientific training in related fields, should be shouting down the warmists/alarmists, and also the “luke-warmists”, with the same arguments. But instead, it’s like you and the “Slayers” are pariahs in the climate community. Where’s the support? Why are you being attacked and insulted? I know it’s the entrenched “consensus” and “vested interests” overriding true science, but they can’t be allowed to hold sway. They are doing great harm every day. Is there no way to stop the madness?

    My reply:

    It is because it is all a lot easier to lie to people and to get people to believe in and then support lies either passively or fanatically than rational people realize. There’s that, and there’s also that people are very stupid today. You come from a generation that I have a lot of respect for (judging by your handsome picture!). People used to be much more rational and critical.
    You must know full well that people haven’t been being raised on anything mentally healthy for a a few generations now, starting with the 68’ers. While the rational and greatest generation was going to the moon, the 68’ers were smoking pot, doing LSD and all manner of drugs, ignoring the greatest feat of human ingenuity of all time, etc. Those people then went into education. Science was where many of them congregated. We are now watching what they have produced. People today are incapable of identifying value – that is what has been removed from their psyche, the concept of value. People are PROGRAMMED instead. They are PROGRAMMED to value Arctic ice over their own availability of energy and the quality of lives of poor people who could really use cheap energy. They don’t form original ideas or thoughts and they do not think critically or rationally. They are automatons. We are in one of the greatest dark ages of rationality of all time. The people who are the alarmists today were the Inquisitors murdering people yesterday – you see all that in their language, their policies, and their goals. The scientific establishment has unfortunately become their priesthood and congregation because almost all scientists today are specialists and simply have naive trust in the “brand” of science. They don’t realize that it is possible to hijack science and related to that they don’t realize that politics is capable of going wrong; they have naive absolute faith in the system they are part of, and they find identity in this system, so they can’t question it. Climate alarm has manufactured the APPEARANCE of doing science, and few people are capable of understanding the philosophical argumentative tricks and subterfuges employed against them. The simple answer is that people have been degenerated. That’s not some “easy-out” answer. It is the truth. I know good engineers and scientists. Even they are too incredulous to critically think of the issue of -40C sunlight…they just can’t believe the lie. They’re too naive and innocent. They have too much trust that “someone must know what they are doing” and be able to make it work. Look all this is well-known and has historical precedent: something about telling a lie that’s big enough, and people will believe it, and will deny the opposite of the lie, which is the truth. We’re in the same old territory, just a different group of people, but a group which has all the potential and naive trust to be conned.

  16. Martin Hodgkins says:

    Thanks Joe; as well as the science your insults are so much better than mine.
    I have a link for you.. which I post here because a) this is how science should be and b) you might be interested.

  17. Martin Hodgkins says:

    Something I meant to say but then got distracted was this.. Surely the energy that comes from the Sun drives all sorts of processes on Earth like making wind which makes waves which erode shorelines etc. Plants convert it to chemical energy and so on. That must be a large part of the incoming energy which is not retained in the electromagnetic spectrum and would not be detected as outgoing energy. I never see this in any model. I don’t see why the budget, so to speak, needs to balance at all in the detectable electromagnetic spectrum.
    Thanks again,

  18. Arfur Bryant says:


    I fundamentally agree with your “reply to RJ”, and I fundamentally agree with your initial post above. Thanks for an intelligent piece of work.

    For what its worth (and I’ve been arguing with cAGW supporters – of any tepidity – with success now for about five years), I strongly suspect that the argument of logic and true science versus dogma and pseudoscience will probably not succeed unless and until the mainstream media (MM) starts to pay attention to the observed data, and logic. Put basically, the MM have been largely responsible for deluding Joe Public by ostensibly supporting ‘the Team’, and have sold many newspapers etc. When the MM fully realise that they have been duped, they will – probably – turn on the Team and start printing stores about ‘how the scientists got it wrong’. They will continue to sell many newspapers.

    At the moment, I believe we are approaching that media cusp, where the ranting of the last decade or so is slowly being dulled by data and a growing realisation of “Why isn’t Co2 doing what they told us it was doing?” So, although it is obviously important for scientists to start practising science, it is possibly more important for the MM to start criticizing it’s own cash cow (cAGW). Then we may see some progress!

    In the meantime, carry on the good work. Thanks.


  19. Jim McGinn says:

    “The concept itself, of an independent thought, eludes them! The abstraction of independent thinking is an unknown mystery to them. They can not imagine – and they outright tell you this all the time – the concept of a single individual forming or holding an independent thought which is better than the mass denominator of some group or another. This is the old “you really think you know better than the ‘consensus’?” argument which you get every single time you engage in debate, in some form or another. It always gets used, they can do nothing but use it. It’s the only thing they can use. You have to realize that what they’re telling you is that THEY have no ability to form an independent thought, . . . ”

    Excellent comment. It perfectly describes my experience trying to talk some sense into meteorologists regarding tornadogenesis:


    Jim McGinn

  20. So some deranged fool from Australia sends me a message via email, and says:

    “[Do] understand, Joe, that extremists on both sides of this debate hate to acknowledge a middle ground, which is where the real science is and where polemics have no place.”

    My reply:

    Goodness gracious Wes, it’s not even that you’re an alarmist, it is that you are a fraud. You boasted about pretending to amplify to the greenhouse effect just a couple of messages ago. You make a very poor skeptic…a fraudulent skeptic in fact, defending the fraudulent basis of alarm, and amplifying it. All too obvious and quite silly. Truth and science is not about the middle ground – the middle ground is for the type of idiots I discussed in my last post who are incapable of rational thinking or independent critical thought, who think that the truth has to lie in the mean consensus. This is retarded…it is anti-thinking, it is endarkened, malevolently stupid, and has no connection to truth. You’ve come full circle now in identifying just exactly who and what you are.

    Previously this fellow had tried to write a rebuttal of my paper in which I had showed with observational data that the Sun heats the ground only when it is shining on the ground, and that this heat was high temperature, and the ground temperature had no sign of a further GHE heating on top of the solar signal. So you want to know what he did? He tried to say it IS okay to model the Earth as flat and sunshine as cold because he came up with some arbitrary way to AMPLIFY the GHE in his new model and made-up math for it. He makes the sun colder and therefore the GHE stronger. And this guy pretends to be a skeptic of climate alarm. He pretends to be a skeptic of climate alarm while he attempts to rebut skeptical papers by AMPLIFYING the greenhouse effect. FULL-BLOWN RETARD FRAUD. The fellows name is David Weston Allen.

  21. bwdave says:

    The ghg radiative forcing nonsense is taught by use of intimidation. The stupid are rewarded not only for their blind faith acceptance of the dogma, but for the pressure they apply against fellow students who dare stray into questions.

  22. Allen Eltor says:

    Exactly, Dave. What goes on is a class of people preparing for a job in life decide to go into the field of mob shepherd and they pick the mob they think they’ll want to manipulate then get government jobs. Truth? Fu** truth, this is being dun under (what’s referred to in governance vernacular) what’s called “color of” or “being done beneath the (flown) colors” of GUB’MUN’t! Ya’W.”

    (This heeyur GUB’MUN’t Flaig says we’unz dun THAWT abowt this sh*t & YEW? wHO’re YEW!? You’re jus’ (whatever cross section of individuals who’ve been selected as the class people to destroy the lives of) SO-an’-So!)

    Al Gore the American Democrat president candidate, lost the election, did a come back tour designed to add value to some alternative energy stocks in Occidental Oil his daddy Senator had left him when he died, because he needed something to do.

    He was gonna manipulate energy markets a little, and get himself some name brand back.

    When he saw the enormous power of terror campaigns from people like Al Qaeda, he decided to keep ramping up the – what? the TERROR for LIFE or PROPERTY if you didn’t – what??

    GO AHEAD and INSTALL HIS ENERGY POLICIES at least, anyway, and IGNORE the ELECTION by – doing what?


    Because the FEAR – the TERROR – for WHAT WOULD COME if we didn’t go ahead and INSTALL HIS POLICIES IN SPITE of THE ELECTIONS

    was TOO GREAT to IGNORE.

    they INFECTED with their

    REWARD those who AIDED with DRAMATIC
    under the FLAG

    when there is a FACTUAL EMERGENCY.

    There never WAS one
    There never WILL be one

    It’s a SCAM
    about MAGIC GAiS

    where MEN with PhDs in MATH tell you THEY – and YOU had BETTER START –
    believe in

    MAGIC gas MIRRORS that RECEIVE 168 WATTS and GIVE 324 BACK to the SOURCE and bleed 324 OUT through it’s BACK for a total of 168 watts IN

    and 648 WATTS OUT.

    And they’re not backing DOWN because – why?


    * * *
    there is an EMERGENCY
    * * *

    and DUE to their COMBINED TERROR


    they had to STOP OBEYING the LAW,

    And drag the “CURRENT SYSTEM of DOING THINGS” to it’s KNEES by FORCE.

    Like DOGS
    their OWNER.

    No? Al Gore, Liberal presidential candidate, didn’t tell billions there is an emergency and they had to drag the current system of government and business to it’s knees by sheer weight of law breaking and ABSOLUTE, SYSTEMATIC REFUSAL to PROCEED as PER their LEGAL OBLIGATIONS?



    Yes he did. And the people who do this stuff to you are no more ashamed than a dog drinking blood out of a hole it’s ripped in a woman’s neck.

    Check their moral pulse yourself. Ask them if they’re ashamed their presidential candidate unleashed literally a TERROR CAMPAIGN to DRAG WORLD CIVILIZATION to it’s ECONOMIC KNEES

    TERROR and
    DRAGGING world civilization to it’s ECONOMIC KNEES.

    They’ll look at you with a gleam of joy of evil getting done you’ll not forget soon I’ll bet ya.

    Good luck to – all of us – who do and say what we can, to whoever we can and will – to put these people into the PROPER HISTORICAL PERSPECTIVE they DESERVE.


    It’s a politically driven crime wave nothing less, nothing more.

  23. Peter Weggeman (Petrus) says:

    Good stuff! Your work belongs in chapter one of any modern text book for atmospheric physics. Kiehl & Trenberth’s diagram of Earth’s energy balance is the smoking gun proving the UN-IPCC global warming fraud. The new Utopians want control of resources and wealth to save the world and make it better. How often have we heard that crap in the last century? In the USA we need to defund the UN-IPCC and revisit Supreme Court and EPA rulings about CO2 pollution and endangerment. Don’t expect progress there until present administration is gone. in the meantime stay cool and keep hammering! I still like the idea of an advertising campaign in selected North American and UK newspapers with brief (quarter page) plain English essays of Postma atmospheric science. It has to be popularized. I am certain funds can be raised for such a campaign.

  24. Thanks Peter. Yes indeed, the argument have all been tackled now and they have nowhere left to run, and they can be made in very simple language. Stay tuned.

  25. Peter Weggeman (Petrus) says:

    Let me know if I can help. Have done similar promotions for global ‘Bev-Pak’ conferences popularizing the new plastic beverage bottle when it was introduced. I was in charge of the team at Continental Can Co (world’s biggest packaging company at the time) that developed and introduced the winning technology in 1978. Glass and cans were out to kill us in the cradle. Today plastic holds most liters of global beverages including water.

  26. Kristi says:

    I’ve spoken to MN legislators who chair the energy policy and finance committees about the problems with wind energy (mandated by MN law). They do a nice job proving your theory that these people are complete wack-jobs and carbon fear-mongering IS their religion – or they are completely ignorant (or both). Here are a few responses to the problems of wind energy I presented them: “I suffer, we all have to suffer”; “Global warming is worse.”; “My district makes money”; “Im too busy to keep the appointment you made to talk with me four months ago.”

  27. authorthat says:

    Hello Joe,
    Just had a brief look. Saw your comment on John Droz work. Think my pushing him in emails to research the wider picture is having an influence. He does well & I’ve added some of his stuff to my blog. My background is military for ten years including intelligence, and the traditional energy industry for 14 years. First, forget tier 2 science. You’ll wear yourself out. There are gatekeepers at every level in both worlds, and especially in finance.
    See, my connections & training allowed me to discover the source of interference in 60 acre stripmining project. were from the chain of command in the finance houses of business. It’s a long story. I have a personal fight with the red shield. It became that way on 9/11, but it took me a while to figure it all out. SOoooo compartmentalized. That’s the intel complex under Omega. I’ve been to Tromso more than once. I have been to the undersgound as well. There’s a 4th gen supersoldier who visits my obscure blog. The discoveries for me have been numerious and life altering to say the least. John is fighting an uphill battle. People are so distracted today, most will never figure it out. Have a look & see what you think. The electronic cage, scalar energetics geoenergetics, for geology & weather, bioenergetics for all plant & animals, psycoenergetic for the mind & emotion. Location of the ark of the covenant, The split of the New Madrid fault is after the false peace treaty of Israel, both are prepared. World’s foremost expert on the mark of the beast, is the biblical witness of Ephraim Dr Bill Deagle. The pole shift from Nemisis moves the planet 1,200 miles where Canada will be where the US is, but with a tilt. Survivable if you The Blogathon Philabuster

  28. Hi Kristi,

    Love the quote “I suffer, we all have to suffer”. WOW. Doesn’t that just show what dives these people!? What they really meant was “I want to suffer, I want us all to suffer”. This system is insane, people are insane, and the insane people are running the mental asylum. If you really start to think about it, this whole place is bonkers. Is it religion, or ignorance? I agree it is both.

  29. Interesting stuff, Philabuster…the multitude of references aren’t lost on me. Thanks for the link to your blog…I’ll read it.

  30. Mary says:

    Kristi, You forgot to mention that one rabid MN legislator acknowledged that the environmental degradation being forced on the planet in order to save us from ourselves is the equivalent of a bloodletting to cure disease – a practice which often resulted in death. Her cold and beady little eyes lit up as she nodded her agreement with the analogy…as if this was somehow a GOOD thing! She was completely undisturbed by the news that this would work no better for the planet than it did for human beings. I believe she said, “We have to do something!” She informed us that, “Global climate change is the #1 cause of species extinction.” (Making it up as they go along, now!) The approach to addressing the irrational fears associated with AGW are every bit as disturbing, like a serial killer shrugging off a string of murders because “people die anyway so it’s not like it really matters.” The installation of industrial wind turbines anywhere and everywhere is evidence of that lunacy. When it was suggested that scientific problems require calm, rational, scientific remedies so leaders should calm down I recall that she nearly had a stroke. “Calm down?! Calm down?! NO! I will not calm down!” (snicker) Her belief in her own superiority is a delusion so firmly entrenched in her psyche that one leaves her presence feeling like you’ve just walked out of The Twilight Zone.

  31. Mary says:

    All of the crazy comments from this well respected legislator in Minnesota were made in order to avoid answering very simple questions about energy policy’s enacted in response to catastrophic AGW. If it is possible to dazzle someone by putting your stupidity on display, color me dazzled.

  32. Peter Weggeman (Petrus) says:

    Question: The K&T diagram and the update including Fasulo 2009 show back radiation from GHGs being absorbed by Earth at twice the strength of direct sunlight. Shouldn’t Earth’s energy budgets include GHG up radiation equal to back radiation but heading (more reasonably) into space. This implies that a few trace gases in the atmosphere are gathering and reemitting FOUR times as much energy as is absorbed by Earth’s surface from sun light. Half of it ostensibly reaching and warming the surface. What nonsense. Where is the up radiation component?

  33. Wow Mary…”eyes lit up” at that analogy huh? Not surprising.

  34. Great question Peter. The most important thing being that trace gases, which are not actually a source of energy release in the first place, emitting more power than the Sun provides to the surface. You know that PhD’s in physics can’t understand that the Sun has to create the water cycle with its own energy, in real-time, and on the daytime side only? They hate when I say that. I just had a PhD in physics from Duke University tell me that the GHE works by magnifying the solar spectrum energy like a magnifying glass, from 240 to 480 W/m^2. They just make up any random meaningless arbitrary thing to protect their faith. The K-T and other GHE diagrams do not intersect reality, because the Earth is not flat: QED – THAT IS ALL THERE IS TO IT!

  35. Mary says:

    Joe, It seems counter-intuitive but these people seem to LIKE it when they realize you understand what it is they are doing. It’s quite disconcerting.

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